ASD, Ponzi Schemes, etc....My Thoughts...

Discussion in 'General Advice' started by 040107, Aug 6, 2008.

  1. 040107

    040107 Member

    Since Vishal removed the ASD forums from showing up in the
    Last Discussions on the main forum, I haven't been paying much
    attention to what's going on in the ASD. Today I stopped by just to
    check out the activities there.

    Myself and several others here knew where ASD would be heading.
    If you don't know what's going on, stop by the ASD forums and
    check it out. Use these people mistakes as your own learning
    experience to avoid such fate in the future.

    I feel terribly bad for the people who've lost money. However,
    seeing the desperation in most of them makes me want to puke.

    Why?

    Because I hear all kinds of excuses that I've heard hundred of times
    over before. It usually starts off something like this...

    "If I had known _____________, I would have never joined..."
    "I only joined because I trusted _____________..."
    "How can that be? This isn't a ponzi scheme...".
    "There were lawyers and attorneys who are members."

    Hope you get the idea.

    C'mon already!

    You guys refused to listen to the naysayers remember? What?
    The founder is such a straight and caring person. The naysayers
    are all just jealous and negative right?

    Hey, I'm angry for you too. But I'm also angry when I try to present
    you with facts and you refused to listen. What do you expect?
    Of course members will always try to present a pretty picture you
    idiot! How else would recruiting continue and new money comes in?

    Even in this mess most members are still hopeful to get their money
    back. In fact, many are even demanding the government pay them
    back their lost money. Worst, some even claim there is a
    government conspiracy to keep the money or something like that.
    But the most pitiful are those who are still in denial.

    Why do part of me feel this way?
    Why do part of me feel these people deserve what's coming?
    Should we empathize with these members.

    Yes and no!

    Like I've said, I feel terribly bad for the members who've lost money.
    However, I realize this is the perfect lesson for them. Trust me, if it
    doesn't happen to them now, it will eventually.

    How can I say such a terribly thing?

    Because I realize why they've lost money on this deal...

    It's not because they trust their friend who introduced them.
    It's not because they thought the founders are nice people.
    It's not that they believe in the lawyers who told them everything is legit.
    It's not because they were simply naive.

    No, it's none of that. The reason they've lost money is simply
    because of their own GREED!

    I know I will anger many people by saying that but these people
    need to hear it and we all need to realize this.

    It is this greed that will end up hurting them again and again. So
    that is why I say that if it doesn't happen to them now, it will
    eventually. In fact, some will never learn and will always be seeking
    the easy way to get the big money. The problem is most of the time
    the quick and easy ways to the big money usually involves in
    legally questionable schemes. Judges, doctors, government officials,
    attorneys, religious members, etc., no matter what their status in
    our society are all inflicted with this "disease".

    This disease is also very contagious. It can spread from our church
    members, our closest friends, our family, etc.

    So how can we keep from making this mistakes?

    Whether it's cash gifting, chain-letters, are any type of MLM and
    recruiting schemes, there are things to watch out for.

    First, how long have that company been in business?

    Most will fly under the radar for the first couple of years and then go
    down. The founder(s) flee with the money and starts another
    scheme. It has happened over and over again people. Proven
    companies have been doing business for 10+ yrs.

    Does the company has a REAL product/service to offer?
    Can you make money by selling the product alone?

    Many company just operate by marketing a lousy product/service
    just so they can stay legal. Don't think for a second that having any
    type of product will make the company bullet-proof.

    How much of the money coming into the company is from product
    sales to members and how much is from product sales to
    non-members?

    When a company is up for investigations, the government also looks
    at the percentage of sales from these two figures. The company
    will be in trouble if most of sales are from members buying. Many
    company operate this way.

    Because of this, many times money just circulate within the company
    from the members and not from direct sales.

    Others impose their monthly quota so that often, members have to
    purchase the product themselves to qualify to for commissions. The
    bottom-line is these companies want to guarantee one thing only
    and that is that the company will always make money.

    Ask yourself, where is the money coming from?

    Majority of the money needs to come from direct sales of the
    products or services to non-members. A way to gauge this would
    be if recruiting were to stop, would members still be able to make
    money without having to put money back in?

    If anyone else has some tips, please post away...

    Some use links to reference:

    Cash Gifting
    http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/alerts/giftalrt.shtm

    Internet Pyramid Schemes
    http://www.ftc.gov/opa/1999/12/cops2.shtm

    Internet Opportunity Scams
    http://www.ftc.gov/opa/1998/03/netopp.shtm

    Envelope Stuffing
    http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2008/04/workathome.shtm

    Others...
    http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/menus/consumer/invest/workhome.shtm

    Obviously, this pertains to USA but many countries also follow the
    same guidelines so check with your local authorities.
     
  2. getagrip

    getagrip Gold Member

    Excellent post! I don't know if the answer is "greed" - I'd say its more like people always are looking for a quick fix, and people will always repond better to "quick and easy" opposed to "hard work".

    I do feel for the people who lost money with ASD, but I don't know if I really feel for people in ASD who continue to defend it, inspite of the fact that ASD got shut down by the Feds.

    Usually, when you see "quick and easy" on the salespage, you are usually going to get burned in the end...that's something everyone who is seeking a home business opportunity should consider before they take that leap of faith in work at home opportunities which offere quick and easy money.
     
  3. pcwork

    pcwork New Member

    Yes, most people loose money online because of their greed. Only a company offering a real product or service will survive.
     
  4. 040107

    040107 Member

    Yes, not everyone who lose money is greedy. It's probably those who
    lost the most...the ones thinking the more money they put in the more
    money they will get out.

    These are also the one who had the most to lose. Consequently, they
    are also the ones who are most vocal when defending their "pot of
    gold".
     
  5. RayvinAndRob

    RayvinAndRob New Member

    As I had began to say before in a previous post (on a thread that got deleted by Iggy, the moderator of the ASD folder), it appears that some of the ASD members are going through a "normal" psychological process called cognitive dissonance.

    Cognitive dissonance happens after a belief, which has been heavily invested in, emotionally and financially, is disconfirmed by overwhelming, contrary evidence. It occurs when that belief is unfounded and proven to be fatally flawed or just plain false.

    A person like this who has had his beliefs disconfirmed will often refuse to accept the evidence, at first. Rather, he will more likely than not begin to find excuses and reasons for why things did not turn out as he had believed they would. And in most cases the believer's level of commitment to the cause will deepen and expand.

    Strangely, what happens next is an increase in recruiting efforts. The person (or group) now feels compelled to prove to others that his excuses for not accepting the evidence are valid ones. And that usually is because of an unconscious need to for approval and confirmation. So the more people he can convince, then the more relief he will experience as the pressure created by the cognitive dissonance in his mind is lifted.

    I haven't been following the latest news about ADS but I'm sure that Bowdoin and his cohorts, if they haven't already been convicted, are as nervous as long-tailed cats in a roomful of rocking chairs!

    My heart goes out to all the newbies who were persuaded to join, really believing this would be their "ticket," and who have lost money or friends or whatever else. In many cases, it is not their fault.

    Let this be a lesson for all of us.

    Rob Nyte
     
  6. opendomain

    opendomain New Member

    I think the thing we need to remember is that 90% of people looking to make money online are green. I've spoken to 100's of people who market now and most, if not all, can share at least one, "I was dumb and got burned" story. I wouldn't go so far as to say greed is the culprit as I would to say HOPE is the culprit.

    I know deep down many of the fine ASD members knew it sounded to good to be true, however; like MANY, MANY people they got caught up in the hype and placed the gut feeling on the back shelf. While their hope of ASD being real played out many dug deeper and deeper and now are in a hole where they cannot get out of. There's on old Simpson episode where police chief Wigam is in a hole with his two fellow officers and they are stuck so they decide to dig to get out. The scene fades to black as you hear police chief Wigam telling one of his fellow officers, "No, no, no, dig UP stupid"

    Things like what is happening with the ASD members right now remind me of this "dig up stupid" tactic as they will continue to back a company that is on the verge of collapse and defend it to the death and even continue to promote it.

    I truly hop that through some miracle ASD is cleared or that these people see their money come back to them, I doubt it, but for their sakes I will hope.

    We can all learn from this and remember that there are people out there who want nothing more to take your money and will develop many great sounding things...just remember:
    If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is
    Never go all in, and if you do be prepared to lose it.
     
  7. 040107

    040107 Member

    Yes, hope is when you invest a few dollars to see some return on
    your money. Whether the return is a lot or a little, you're still
    hopeful because there is a positive return.

    Greed is when you put more than what you can afford to lose in an
    attempt to get back many times what you put in.

    Greed is when you ignore the "negative" facts about what you're
    doing in an attempt to cash in before it blows up.

    Greed is when you don't want to believe any negative even when
    it's true in an attempt get some fast cash.

    Greed is all of that and more...

    Those are did put just what they can afford to lose, they'll just move
    on. It's the folks who've put more than what they could afford to
    lose who will be feeling the pain the most. Regardless if they're
    green or if they're good people, greed got the most of them.

    Hopefully these people will get some sort of reimbursement and
    learn something from all of this.
     
  8. RayvinAndRob

    RayvinAndRob New Member

    Learning the art of persuasion helps one to avoid succumbing to the psychological laws of influence.

    Becoming aware of how these laws operate is the antidote to falling into the wrong hands.

    Listening to our intuition, or "gut", will often tell us what action to take. Sometimes that means no action.

    Making a list of pros and cons during the evaluation stage of a business proposal can reveal important and critical information.

    Allowing oneself to detach emotionally from a concept permits one to think more critically about it.

    Letting extra time pass before making a final decision often sheds new light on the situation.

    Rob
     
  9. mountainmom5

    mountainmom5 Gold Member

    It felt like a riot on the forum at times and I am so glad it has settled back to what it was before ASD showed it's face - a friendly informative place for people to come to - to get good honest evaluations and different opinions on things.

    That was what bothered me the most about the ASD deal was the feelings, and spirit of the ones that were so heavily involved - basically calling the seasoned network 'warriors' ignorant, etc...

    So, instead of rubbing salt into fresh wounds, lets help each other to get back on the road to success![​IMG]
     

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