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040107
Member
Joined: 14 Apr 2007
Posts: 302
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# Posted: 6 Aug 2008 20:58 · Edited by: 040107
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Since Vishal removed the ASD forums from showing up in the
Last Discussions on the main forum, I haven't been paying much
attention to what's going on in the ASD. Today I stopped by just to
check out the activities there.
Myself and several others here knew where ASD would be heading.
If you don't know what's going on, stop by the ASD forums and
check it out. Use these people mistakes as your own learning
experience to avoid such fate in the future.
I feel terribly bad for the people who've lost money. However,
seeing the desperation in most of them makes me want to puke.
Why?
Because I hear all kinds of excuses that I've heard hundred of times
over before. It usually starts off something like this...
"If I had known _____________, I would have never joined..."
"I only joined because I trusted _____________..."
"How can that be? This isn't a ponzi scheme...".
"There were lawyers and attorneys who are members."
Hope you get the idea.
C'mon already!
You guys refused to listen to the naysayers remember? What?
The founder is such a straight and caring person. The naysayers
are all just jealous and negative right?
Hey, I'm angry for you too. But I'm also angry when I try to present
you with facts and you refused to listen. What do you expect?
Of course members will always try to present a pretty picture you
idiot! How else would recruiting continue and new money comes in?
Even in this mess most members are still hopeful to get their money
back. In fact, many are even demanding the government pay them
back their lost money. Worst, some even claim there is a
government conspiracy to keep the money or something like that.
But the most pitiful are those who are still in denial.
Why do part of me feel this way?
Why do part of me feel these people deserve what's coming?
Should we empathize with these members.
Yes and no!
Like I've said, I feel terribly bad for the members who've lost money.
However, I realize this is the perfect lesson for them. Trust me, if it
doesn't happen to them now, it will eventually.
How can I say such a terribly thing?
Because I realize why they've lost money on this deal...
It's not because they trust their friend who introduced them.
It's not because they thought the founders are nice people.
It's not that they believe in the lawyers who told them everything is legit.
It's not because they were simply naive.
No, it's none of that. The reason they've lost money is simply
because of their own GREED!
I know I will anger many people by saying that but these people
need to hear it and we all need to realize this.
It is this greed that will end up hurting them again and again. So
that is why I say that if it doesn't happen to them now, it will
eventually. In fact, some will never learn and will always be seeking
the easy way to get the big money. The problem is most of the time
the quick and easy ways to the big money usually involves in
legally questionable schemes. Judges, doctors, government officials,
attorneys, religious members, etc., no matter what their status in
our society are all inflicted with this "disease".
This disease is also very contagious. It can spread from our church
members, our closest friends, our family, etc.
So how can we keep from making this mistakes?
Whether it's cash gifting, chain-letters, are any type of MLM and
recruiting schemes, there are things to watch out for.
First, how long have that company been in business?
Most will fly under the radar for the first couple of years and then go
down. The founder(s) flee with the money and starts another
scheme. It has happened over and over again people. Proven
companies have been doing business for 10+ yrs.
Does the company has a REAL product/service to offer?
Can you make money by selling the product alone?
Many company just operate by marketing a lousy product/service
just so they can stay legal. Don't think for a second that having any
type of product will make the company bullet-proof.
How much of the money coming into the company is from product
sales to members and how much is from product sales to
non-members?
When a company is up for investigations, the government also looks
at the percentage of sales from these two figures. The company
will be in trouble if most of sales are from members buying. Many
company operate this way.
Because of this, many times money just circulate within the company
from the members and not from direct sales.
Others impose their monthly quota so that often, members have to
purchase the product themselves to qualify to for commissions. The
bottom-line is these companies want to guarantee one thing only
and that is that the company will always make money.
Ask yourself, where is the money coming from?
Majority of the money needs to come from direct sales of the
products or services to non-members. A way to gauge this would
be if recruiting were to stop, would members still be able to make
money without having to put money back in?
If anyone else has some tips, please post away...
Some use links to reference:
Cash Gifting
http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/alerts/giftalrt.shtm
Internet Pyramid Schemes
http://www.ftc.gov/opa/1999/12/cops2.shtm
Internet Opportunity Scams
http://www.ftc.gov/opa/1998/03/netopp.shtm
Envelope Stuffing
http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2008/04/workathome.shtm
Others...
http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/menus/consumer/invest/workhome.shtm
Obviously, this pertains to USA but many countries also follow the
same guidelines so check with your local authorities.
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getagrip
Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Posts: 1500
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# Posted: 6 Aug 2008 22:26 · Edited by: getagrip
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Excellent post! I don't know if the answer is "greed" - I'd say its more like people always are looking for a quick fix, and people will always repond better to "quick and easy" opposed to "hard work".
I do feel for the people who lost money with ASD, but I don't know if I really feel for people in ASD who continue to defend it, inspite of the fact that ASD got shut down by the Feds.
Usually, when you see "quick and easy" on the salespage, you are usually going to get burned in the end...that's something everyone who is seeking a home business opportunity should consider before they take that leap of faith in work at home opportunities which offere quick and easy money.
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pcwork
Member
Joined: 12 Aug 2006
Posts: 1627
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# Posted: 6 Aug 2008 22:29
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Yes, most people loose money online because of their greed. Only a company offering a real product or service will survive.
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040107
Member
Joined: 14 Apr 2007
Posts: 302
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# Posted: 6 Aug 2008 22:51
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Yes, not everyone who lose money is greedy. It's probably those who
lost the most...the ones thinking the more money they put in the more
money they will get out.
These are also the one who had the most to lose. Consequently, they
are also the ones who are most vocal when defending their "pot of
gold".
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RayvinAndRob
Member
Joined: 22 Jun 2007
Posts: 195
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# Posted: 6 Aug 2008 23:32
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As I had began to say before in a previous post (on a thread that got deleted by Iggy, the moderator of the ASD folder), it appears that some of the ASD members are going through a "normal" psychological process called cognitive dissonance.
Cognitive dissonance happens after a belief, which has been heavily invested in, emotionally and financially, is disconfirmed by overwhelming, contrary evidence. It occurs when that belief is unfounded and proven to be fatally flawed or just plain false.
A person like this who has had his beliefs disconfirmed will often refuse to accept the evidence, at first. Rather, he will more likely than not begin to find excuses and reasons for why things did not turn out as he had believed they would. And in most cases the believer's level of commitment to the cause will deepen and expand.
Strangely, what happens next is an increase in recruiting efforts. The person (or group) now feels compelled to prove to others that his excuses for not accepting the evidence are valid ones. And that usually is because of an unconscious need to for approval and confirmation. So the more people he can convince, then the more relief he will experience as the pressure created by the cognitive dissonance in his mind is lifted.
I haven't been following the latest news about ADS but I'm sure that Bowdoin and his cohorts, if they haven't already been convicted, are as nervous as long-tailed cats in a roomful of rocking chairs!
My heart goes out to all the newbies who were persuaded to join, really believing this would be their "ticket," and who have lost money or friends or whatever else. In many cases, it is not their fault.
Let this be a lesson for all of us.
Rob Nyte
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opendomain
Member
Joined: 19 Aug 2007
Posts: 528
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# Posted: 7 Aug 2008 15:12
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I think the thing we need to remember is that 90% of people looking to make money online are green. I've spoken to 100's of people who market now and most, if not all, can share at least one, "I was dumb and got burned" story. I wouldn't go so far as to say greed is the culprit as I would to say HOPE is the culprit.
I know deep down many of the fine ASD members knew it sounded to good to be true, however; like MANY, MANY people they got caught up in the hype and placed the gut feeling on the back shelf. While their hope of ASD being real played out many dug deeper and deeper and now are in a hole where they cannot get out of. There's on old Simpson episode where police chief Wigam is in a hole with his two fellow officers and they are stuck so they decide to dig to get out. The scene fades to black as you hear police chief Wigam telling one of his fellow officers, "No, no, no, dig UP stupid"
Things like what is happening with the ASD members right now remind me of this "dig up stupid" tactic as they will continue to back a company that is on the verge of collapse and defend it to the death and even continue to promote it.
I truly hop that through some miracle ASD is cleared or that these people see their money come back to them, I doubt it, but for their sakes I will hope.
We can all learn from this and remember that there are people out there who want nothing more to take your money and will develop many great sounding things...just remember:
If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is
Never go all in, and if you do be prepared to lose it.
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040107
Member
Joined: 14 Apr 2007
Posts: 302
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# Posted: 7 Aug 2008 16:27 · Edited by: 040107
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Yes, hope is when you invest a few dollars to see some return on
your money. Whether the return is a lot or a little, you're still
hopeful because there is a positive return.
Greed is when you put more than what you can afford to lose in an
attempt to get back many times what you put in.
Greed is when you ignore the "negative" facts about what you're
doing in an attempt to cash in before it blows up.
Greed is when you don't want to believe any negative even when
it's true in an attempt get some fast cash.
Greed is all of that and more...
Those are did put just what they can afford to lose, they'll just move
on. It's the folks who've put more than what they could afford to
lose who will be feeling the pain the most. Regardless if they're
green or if they're good people, greed got the most of them.
Hopefully these people will get some sort of reimbursement and
learn something from all of this.
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RayvinAndRob
Member
Joined: 22 Jun 2007
Posts: 195
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# Posted: 7 Aug 2008 17:12
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Learning the art of persuasion helps one to avoid succumbing to the psychological laws of influence.
Becoming aware of how these laws operate is the antidote to falling into the wrong hands.
Listening to our intuition, or "gut", will often tell us what action to take. Sometimes that means no action.
Making a list of pros and cons during the evaluation stage of a business proposal can reveal important and critical information.
Allowing oneself to detach emotionally from a concept permits one to think more critically about it.
Letting extra time pass before making a final decision often sheds new light on the situation.
Rob
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Source of Influence-- All our philosophy is dry as dust if it is not immediately translated into some act of living service.(Mahatma Mohandas K. Gandhi)
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mountainmom5
Joined: 30 Aug 2007
Posts: 1123
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# Posted: 7 Aug 2008 23:13
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It felt like a riot on the forum at times and I am so glad it has settled back to what it was before ASD showed it's face - a friendly informative place for people to come to - to get good honest evaluations and different opinions on things.
That was what bothered me the most about the ASD deal was the feelings, and spirit of the ones that were so heavily involved - basically calling the seasoned network 'warriors' ignorant, etc...
So, instead of rubbing salt into fresh wounds, lets help each other to get back on the road to success!
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